Star Citizen: Reverse the Verse - Persistent Universe Design
The developers cover Star Citizen 3.3 plans: hangar and habitat instancing, mission givers and shared missions, Lorville's no-fly zone, fuel and truck stops, long-range scanning, scramble race legality, space weather, command-and-control gameplay, and running a space station.
TL;DRHangars and habs are likely not instanced and may be tied together at specific locations, but how many exist, whether they are expanded or rented, and how it works are still undecided and need further discussion.
This is something that we're going to have a meeting about next week, in particular about habs, and I think it also applies to hangars as well. So the discussion is going to be: are habs instanced or are hangars instanced? Just because if somebody's trying to take off, if 500 people are trying to take off, do we wait in line? That kind of aspect. So, more than likely, they will not be instanced. I'm sure CR will want to have something: okay, if 5,000 people want to live on Hurston, and in particular Lorville, then there's maybe 5,000 apartments. You might have a closer apartment than I. CR might have the closest apartment kind of thing. So that's just kind of like the real world. And then we've talked about, obviously, the more players that want to go there, it has economic factors associated with it. So therefore, if you want to rent there or something like that, it becomes more expensive as it goes up. And then at that point, you can get priced out or people will move around the universe. So with the hangars, I would consider that hangars and habs are basically kind of interconnected. So if you have a hab, more than likely you're going to have a hangar associated with it, possibly even a garage. So as far as player hangars go, then it might be that those are at very specific locations, and that's something that we still need to kind of work out: do we have them all, or do we have the ability to have 500 at Lorville and then 500 at microTech and then 500... It's these kind of conversations that we need to [have].
It's one of the interesting, I wouldn't say challenges, but opportunities that Star Citizen provides us. In most any other MMO, the idea of not instancing this many hangars would be absurd because you just don't have the real estate. For Star Citizen, with the size and scale of our moons and then the upcoming size and scale of our planets after that, we actually have the real estate to explore this as an option.
Yeah. We can talk about it. We can look at it. We can do test mock-ups of: okay, we have a spaceport. How big is that spaceport? How many hangars can we actually get in there that look reasonable? Or is it that basically you're renting a space as a storage, and then at that point they bring your ship up and then you can take off. And there's only a limited number of player hangars there, and there's a limited number of player hangars on New Babbage and Horizon, Pyro, that kind of stuff, or Terra. Those are the things that we need to think about and have a discussion between Tony, Chris, myself and Paul Reindell just to figure out: okay, how are we going to take this? How are we going to push this forward?
I remember when we introduced the idea of land claim licenses back at CitizenCon last year. There was a lot of discussion about how many of these can you actually put out there. And when Tony did the math, it was like if every single Star Citizen had a four kilometer plot of land, there was still enough room on one of our larger planets, not one of the small ones, to put everybody on one. A hangar isn't going to be four kilometers.
Thinking about our small hangars versus our medium versus our extra large hangars, there's quite a size difference in there. We're working towards creating them in a modular way, so then at that point in time we can actually switch skins or we can switch colors or switch building styles, and then we have new hangars.
TL;DRThere will be more missions, but the live team is focused on rebuilding existing mission types in modular pieces so modifiers like time limits or AI can be added later.
There will be more missions, but as far as variations go... The types of missions: fetch missions, kill missions. Right now there's so many different wrappers that we can put on it. A lot of our focus, because our live team is not as expansive as some of the rest of our teams, is actually putting content on Hurston and building up that content, building up how we do things in a modular way. So right now we put out a lot of missions, and for example a fetch mission: in the beginning, it was hand-built, so it was strong-armed, let's force it through, let's basically script it in a certain way. And then now that it's in, now that we've tested it, we're like, okay, we feel that's a good mission type, let's go through and make it in modular pieces. So that's what the guys have been doing, basically rebuilding these things in modular pieces. So then when we're talking about a fetch mission, well, we can add time associated with it. We can add AI associated with it, so that you're dealing with things running away from you. It's all these different types of scenarios that we want to build and have these modifiers associated with them. So we're just rebuilding those logics on a fair amount of those right now.
Because we don't know it's good. We've got to test it out and see what works, what doesn't work. And then at that point, we figure out a way to make it modular. Game development.
Not for 3.3. For 3.4, I think that will depend on how... Well, it will depend on 3.3, yes, it will. So with OCS, but then it will also depend on, in particular, our mission teams and our US teams, basically lists that they need to move on to. So right now, I don't think it's at the top of those lists. However, it is something that we are concerned about and we want to be able to do.
TL;DRYes, lawful mission givers exist, and lawful work will tend to come from corporate job boards while criminal or pirate missions will come through direct one-on-one messages.
Yes, we do have lawful mission givers. I'm trying to remember what Recco is. As far as Clovis Darneely, he's kind of a mix, almost like Miles is. But I believe Recco is a positive mission giver because she's dealing with salvage and cargo. And then from our standpoint, this is something that Luke and I were discussing yesterday: how we distribute missions, how we give them out. So a lot of times job boards and a lot of the lawful things will come from bigger corporations, will come from a job board setting or something like that. Versus from a criminal setting, you don't want to say, oh, hey, I want you to go out and kill this person. So it'll be more like a direct message or something like that. So those are the way that we're thinking about things. And yes, we will have lawful mission givers, but usually a lot of the missions that would be of a pirate's influence would be coming directly from those one-on-one conversations.
TL;DRLong-range scanning is envisioned as slowly gathering distant anomalies you then zoom in on, while the vehicle team's current work is short-range pinging of nearby ships, rocks and debris.
It depends on what you consider long-range sensors. So when we consider long-range scanning, that would be almost like the Hubble telescope or something like that, where you're looking across, let's say, a quarter to all the way across the universe. And Tony's thought behind it is that you just kind of open your lens and you sit there and you wait for this information to come to you, and it takes a certain period of time for it to come to you. And then at that point you start seeing these anomalies, and then you zoom in onto those and you say, okay, what is this? And it takes extra time associated with that. Versus right now what Kirk and Mark Abent and the US vehicle team is working on is what I would consider kind of short range scanning, where we're dealing with pinging and we're dealing with things that are...
Yeah, things that are around you. And we're talking roughly, let's say, 10 to 50K. So 10,000 to 50,000 kilometers away from you. And so at that point, you're looking for something, whether that be another ship or rocks or derelict debris or something like that.
TL;DRNothing is planned for on-foot waypoints right now; the UI team still needs to finish the FPS map and various passes, and a beacon feature would need more discussion.
We don't have anything planned right now. Right now from a UI standpoint, there's a fair amount of things that need a second treatment. So the only thing that's missing now that is a fairly major feature from the UI standpoint is the FPS map. And so I think once we get that in and working the way that we want it to work, then they'll be going through and doing passes on the FPS as well as the ships and then the star map and then a few other things that we need to go through and do passes on. As far as dropping a beacon or dropping something for navigating around, I would have to sit down and talk with the guys and just say, okay, how useful would this be? What are things besides just saying, okay, you are here, this is where you want to go in the star map? That to me is the part that I think we need to talk about a little bit more.
Trust me, it is a reference. When we talk about zooming in and when it transfers between street view and basically just the overall map, these are things that we are referencing. But again, it's time and it's focus.
This is something that we have talked about. For the most part, I think that we might either do it outside of legal zones, so then at that point in time it's up in the air. You can do whatever you want to. And then it might be, if this is legal, this is kind of like, all right, I'm signing up for this. Think of it as almost like, well, Running Man wasn't legal, but... That's kind of the idea, is that this is something that the player opts into: I want to go out there and put myself on the lam and try this out.
TL;DRLong-range ships can refuel at truck stops or at Starfarers; fuel will be rebalanced repeatedly, aiming for roughly one refuel every one to two hours of play, with values changing between versions.
Well, there's two different ways. There's the truck stops or rest stops or whatever we want to call them. Then there's Starfarers. And that was kind of the idea. Obviously, we're going to have to go through a whole fuel rebalancing when we basically turn on OCS, going from Crusader all the way to Hurston, and then as soon as we go to microTech and ArcCorp, we'll do another rebalancing. But the overall goal for me is somewhere between maybe one to two hours of whatever the player's doing: they've got to refuel maybe once every two hours, depending on what they're doing at that time. If they're basically on their booster all the time, well, yeah, you're probably going to have to refuel. But if you're QTing all over the place, you might have to refuel more.
And if I'm allowed to speak in my own opinion here, I would imagine that regardless of how well we intend and how well we practice and how well we test and how well we research, whatever the version of how long you can go before refueling is when 3.3.0 drops will not be the same as it is in 3.3.1. We have this community that can sit there and put these things through the paces.
Once we have different archetypes, then we'll throw in different things. I think Luke adjusted it, maybe it might be four right now, but that might go back up to eight, that might stay at four, that might go up to twelve. It's something that as our QA department gets in there and really starts playing it... I mean, right now I think when Luke opens that level it takes over 32 gigs of RAM to open up that level. So there's a lot of work that goes into those.
Actually, I honestly don't know. I don't know if our guy here finished with it. Hannes. So I don't know if he finished it, because I know that he was working on water, and I think before then he was working on roads. So if roads have been implemented so that we can actually just paint them on, then I think they would go in. But if it requires some more tech in order to actually get them to blend right and all of that, then Marco and Ian will not want to put that stuff out.
TL;DRTodd Papy hopes so: planets and systems are big enough that remote areas should have low odds of encounters, though you could still meet someone out there.
I would like to think so, yeah. In particular, we have what we consider hotspots of areas. Now, the thing is that you might come across somebody out in the middle of nowhere, and then it's kind of like the Wild West of: I don't know you, you don't know me. But the thing is that I think our planets are big enough and I think our solar system is big enough that if you go out to the middle of nowhere, yeah, you might not be found, whether you like that or not.
I expect to see an entire YouTube series of some hermit that has just gone out and plopped a land claim license on some random moon in some obscure system where he literally just sits. That is his Star Citizen experience, just waiting to see how long it takes somebody to find him.
It all depends on probabilities, and I think for those cases we will have very low chances of probabilities, in particular once you start getting towards the extents of the universe.
TL;DRDirect transfers, such as paying crew via Service Beacon or mobiGlas, have been discussed and are wanted, but general player trading and how to keep it fair still need more discussion.
We've talked about it regarding part of the Service Beacon, being able to actually pay your employees. So for example, let's say you and I go out on a mission, and since I'm the ship owner, I get paid. You don't get paid right now. But that's something we've talked about, whether that be via Service Beacon or some other kind of interface via the mobiGlas, but that is something that Tony and I do want and we do feel it's needed.
Now, as far as trading and all of that, I think we'll need to talk about that more and figure out the logistics of: How do we transfer? How do you make sure that everything's fair? That kind of stuff. And then if somebody's not fair, is it on the player that did the trade to basically say, no, you fucked up? Because I can guarantee you somebody's going to be unhappy about a trade sometime or another.
There's absolutely no reason why we couldn't right now. If I asked Steve Bender, what would Steve Bender say? Steve Bender would probably say the same exact thing.
TL;DRRunning a space station isn't being designed yet; Todd Papy wants to see how the modular system works first, and it might end up as something else, like a surface option.
I want to see how our modular system works first. I think then there's other key things that you'd have to think about. Just like a ship, then you've got to think about power, you've got to think about security and revenue and all these other things. In my mind, it's almost like owning a strip mall. Like, okay, I'm going to rent out this corner unit to 7-Eleven. I'm going to rent out this unit to a dry cleaner. I'm going to rent out this thing to that. So there's a fair amount of interface systems that would need to go into that. So from my standpoint, we'd have to break it down from system design. And then we need to be able to see how far our modular system can be pushed. Just because if we open it up to one person, I would have to sit there and talk with CR and Tony: how many of these do we have per solar system? Is it five? Is it 50? And also, I can see the appeal of it, but the other thing is that it might be we do it on the surface. There's other ways that we can do it.
Maybe it's some kind of management system for the existing truck stops. Maybe you can buy your way into a controlling interest on a truck stop and you get some kind of revenue from it.
This was done before I was around, and so I would like to just kind of sit there and pick CR's brain, pick Tony's brain on, first off, what they were thinking for this, so that I actually make sure that we're hitting the mark and getting what CR expects across. And then it's also what's going to be interesting about that as an owner. Does that mean that basically it's like a slumlord and shit always is breaking and you've got to go around and fix everything, or what makes it interesting?
TL;DRMissions are currently tied to the player's account and reputation, so the player gets paid rather than the ship, with ship-related warnings for combat missions and bounty proof still to be worked out.
No, it's because when I go in, it's based off of my account. So therefore, when I land and I'm going and selling something or I'm going and turning something in, I'm the one that's actually getting paid. So as far as it being based off the ship, what we want to do is if it's a combat mission, we want to be able to kind of warn the player: hey, this is a combat mission, you might not want to bring in a Crucible or something like that. So it's those types of things where we want to kind of say, hey, kind of expect this. But as far as getting paid or anything like that, one of the things that we'll need to work out is if it's a bounty or something like that: do I actually bring the body in? But it could be that, let's say, this character has a monocle, or a bracelet, or something that makes them unique. A certain space suit. And you bring in this pink fluffy space suit that is always worn by this character. Then you know that that one's dead.
TL;DRYes, space weather like meteor storms is wanted and cloud tech is progressing, but how it will play is unknown and optimizations are still needed before it can run in the PU.
Yes. For example, the cloud stuff that the graphics team is working on: there's a lot of interesting things that we can do with that. And then there's also the weather stuff that Carsten's working on. I don't know how those things are going to play just yet, but what I do know is I want to be able to tie systems into those and make sure that they affect your ship or they affect you as a player somehow. And then obviously with the meteor storms or those types of things, those are aspects that we do want to get in. I think the cloud tech is probably closer, and so then that might lead to nebulas or space clouds or... I don't know what we can do with it yet. And so once Ali finishes the code, or those guys finish the code, then I think there's some optimizations that still need to happen in order for us to be able to run it in the PU, and then we can start having fun.
Well, everything should take time. So whether that's unloading the ship, repairing the ship, refueling the ship, yes, it should take time. It's just right now we have the quick and easy buttons of, okay, let's do this right now, and then at that point we will start adding timers into these things.
I know Dave and the writers want to do that, and from a gameplay aspect, we want to do it as well. That could be as simple as the UEE fleet going through, let's say, Stanton, and that is, let's say, a week-long experience or something like that. And then from there, does that actually kill off certain characters, or does that adjust the way that the pirates act for a certain period of time, that kind of stuff. So as far as killing off a major character, those types, that I don't know. I don't know what the writers' plans are for that. That's usually all driven through lore. So next time you have Dave on, ask him that question.
TL;DRCommand and control has only been explored at a high level, with crew roles broken down, and the focus is first on getting the Connie working well before scaling up to capital ships.
We have very high level ideas, and we've sat down and we've talked about what is a captain doing, what is a helmsman doing. We have all of our different position seats that we want to do and make sure that we go through and break those down and say, okay, what's needed from an engineer's standpoint, what's needed from a helmsman's standpoint, what's needed from a captain basically saying, okay, here, attack this target. And then they're using basically the big globe and saying, that target, I mean that target, right there. And then all the turrets are informed, all the weapon officers are informed, so on and so forth. From my standpoint, let's get the Connie working the way that we want it to work. And so we do have the big capital ships out there, and they're coming very, very soon. But I want to make sure that the bulk of that stuff works first, before we scale it up. And then at that point, we understand this is what a weapons officer means. And the thing for us is making sure that they have 10 to 15 different things on their plate that they're trying to spin. And if they don't have that stuff, then what makes it interesting? Are they just kind of this red shirt that just sits there the whole time and doesn't engage with anything? Or are they actually having fun?
TL;DRFor 3.3, Lorville launches with a basic restricted zone that warns, counts down and then kills you at a hard deck, with flight paths and IFCS enforcement planned later to prevent griefing.
Well, let's say this tablet is Lorville. The idea would be that there is a zone over it that you wouldn't be able to fly into. What we will be releasing for 3.3 with Lorville is Tier 0. So that means that there's no flight paths or anything like that. Theoretically, you can fly in, and then we have a spaceport right in the center. So there's a spaceport in the center, and it's basically, think of it as a donut that you fly into, kind of thing. And then you can land there, and then if you get too close to the sides, you'll get warned: you're coming close to a restricted zone. And then once you get into the restricted zone, it will start counting down, and it'll start saying you need to leave. And then there will be a hard deck where basically you'll hit and you'll die. In the future, it would be that this whole thing is a restricted zone, and then you have flight paths in and out of this, very similar to any major city. And then at that point, if you deviate from those flight paths, then IFCS basically puts you back onto the spline.
If you turn everything off, I think we'd probably say that you can't turn everything off. Or if you do turn everything off, then you hit that hard deck and you die. So with the no-fly zone, the main thing for us is to make sure that players can't grief other players. Because Area 18 and Lorville are open air, theoretically there could be somebody that just sits up there and just shoots into the town. And if you are just happenstance and basically get rained on by a missile, what's fun about that? What's interesting about that? So right now we don't think there's anything fun about it. So we just want to make sure that we're going through and actually building something that doesn't grief players.